The family known as the body of Christ is sometimes dysfunctional. While I don't subscribe to a theology that women pastors should preach, it's not a belief I'm willing to die over like the doctrine of the resurrection, and I think some grace can be shown to others who think differenty. In the scheme of things, I think this is a minor issue. I think the bookstores in essence treated this magazine and its interested readers as if it were porn and is if they were buying porn. If the world sees us treating each other this way (being petty towards one another), why would they want to be part of our (for the most part) wonderful family?

What would Jesus say about us. Here we are trying to help others know He is the only way, and we cant get along. I really dont think He would care male nor female. As we submit to what He has for us He lead and guide us. I cant see how anyone would truly desire to be a pastor, unless God had placed that desire in them its a thankless job. Each person in the Body of Christ should spend more time in His presence and His word I'm sure He will make all things clear to us all. We must pray more and debate less.

I think the issue is less about whether women should serve as pastors and more about the fact that Christians are called to unity, not division among themselves. I suppose if the stores are owned by Southern Baptists and their beliefs conflict, then they have the right to pull the magazines. But do they also censor anything with a conflicting doctrine within the scope of Christianity - about the present use of spiritual gifts, about baptizing in Jesus' name vs. the titles, about baptism of infants vs. adults making those decisions? This is an issue which, to me, falls under the category of differences of interpretation of the Word of God.

I respect the right of each individual to decide for themselves, but my personal belief is that women can be (and are) called to serve God in a variety of roles, including pastors. John 1:12 clearly states, "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name." Romans 8:14-15 says "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father." And 1 John 3:2: "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." Because we are granted sonship, we are heirs. Romans 8:17 states "And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together." I thank God for the privileges He has bestowed on all of us who believe in and serve him -- men and women alike.

I Timothy 3:1-7 gives the qualification of a pastor, shepherd, or overseer---what ever you want to call it. I don't really care what the term is for the office, but I DO care that the Bible says, "the husband of one wife." How can you be a husband if you are a woman? Obviously you would not believe the whole Bible, or preach the whole Bible if you are a woman and a "pastor" of a church. I would like to know what the interpretation of that Scripture would be for a church who has a woman pastor.

It would be illogical to believe that I Timothy 3:1-7 ("husband of one wife") is referring to anything other than polygamy. If it was written to exclude women, then it also excludes the Apostle Paul and Jesus Christ Himself because they were not married. The rest of that verse and following would exclude all childless men as well.

Acts 2:17 says that "your sons and your daughters shall prophesy" after God pours forth His Spirit. In Acts 21:9 four unmarried women prophets are mentioned. To try to make a case for male only pastorship would mean ignoring many other scriptures.

Can we ignore the fact that God chose Mary Magdalene (John 20:17) to be the first evangelist? "Go to my brothers and tell..."

Thank you for the information about "pulling magazine/female pastors".....hmmm...
First, Lifeway does not need my money to generate revenue so I will cease and desist shopping there.
Second, I find it quite gauling to have anyone tell me that God does not talk to me...therefore, I am nothing in God's eyes. That's exactly what people are saying when they make these kind of bone-head decisions. I can only assume God's intervention in my life and leading me to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ did indeed come from God....thank you very much!
Third, these bone-headed people who continually insist on "picking and choosing" select texts from Scripture are doing the Body of Christ a great injustice.
I can only assume the Old Testament Scriptures are "taboo" to these bone-heads....if not then why not preach and promote...Leviticus 20:9, "If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death"...oh, there's so much more!!!
I can only hope, in my generation, these bone-heads will take a more serious look at Scripture with regard to exegesis and well informed study.
Why must these bone-heads continue their
"cabbage-headed" preaching that tends to cause so much harm?
May God bless us all. Amen
Rev. Linda Seymour
Horizons of Hope Church
Ft. Worth, Texas

Those verses in Timothy that say that women should not teach are actually saying that the women should learn, and not teach because they didn't know what they were talking about. At that time, Jewish women weren't allowed to learn, so Paul says a very powerful pro-female thing by commanding them to learn. It's extremely important that Christians know the context of the books of the Bible so that they'll know how to properly interpret them.

For a minister of the Word, you really should not refer to other christians as "bone-headed people" and their "cabbage-headed preaching". So what if some do not believe that women should be preachers -- let's not do the name calling thing. You have your beliefs and they have theirs. Get over it.

Wow. Whatever we believe on this issue, I think we could all eliminate words like "bone head" and more in reference to fellow believers.

Let's major and on the majors and minor on the minors, and practice a lot of grace for all the areas in between.

Wow. Whatever we believe on this issue, I think we could all eliminate words like "bone head" and more in reference to fellow believers.

Let's major and on the majors and minor on the minors, and practice a lot of grace for all the areas in between.

I am disappointed that the bookstore would exert this type of censure and control. They appear partial and discriminatory in that they have singled out one issue which conflicts with their beliefs and continue to carry numerous books and CD's that counter their doctrine. Instead of hiding the magazine behind their counter and selling them upon request, I would rather they be hot or cold....remove them from the store completely or place them on a display where their very diverse, intelligent, and biblically literate customers can make their own decision about whether or not they choose to purchase it.

Dr. Carolyn Clansy Miller
www.drcarolynmiller.wordpress.com

Here are some thoughts on the above comments:

@Linda - It's not a matter of God not talking to you. It's a matter of the way that God chooses to use women.

@Kelly - as I mentioned to Linda, it's not that He doesn't talk to us, or as you suggest, that people are implying that we are not God's children; it's just that we have different jobs in serving Him.

@Ela - Does it say in either Acts passage that the prophetesses were prophesying before a mixed-gender body of believers? I don't believe it does.

What about I Cor 14:34-35 "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church."

Would any of the commenters care to share their thoughts on these verses in I Cor?

I think this people should re-evaluate thier
faith,belief and practice if they are truly christian who valued much thier faith in the LORD JESUS CHRIST,they must consider the truth about women as pastors in the church.We respect thier belief and rights on what they feel is right according to thier conviction,but to pull out the men pastors out and replace it all with women pastors,the conotatations is something very alarming.does it rang a bell?

Regardless of how one feels on this issue, I don't think anything is to be gained by called each other names i.e. "bone-headed". I try to love and treat respectfully those who disagree with me on "issues" that are controversial. Please do not use disrespectful names when referring to our brothers and sisters in Christ.

We must understand the whole word of God and not take scriptures out of context. We must remember that a text without a context is a pretext. In Gods word he said that my husband is the head of my household (Ephe. 5:22-27). Now if He is the head of my house why would I think it would be o.k. for me as a woman to be the head of Gods house. We as the church have begun to take on the worlds thinking by saying if a woman can be the head of a company,etc then why can't she be the head of a church.That's what the world does, that's how they think, and it ought not to be so for us. The word clearly says that women are not to usurp authority over a man. In I Timothy chapter three all of those qualifications state "He should be or He shouldn't be. My husband is a Pastor does that make me any less than him...not by any means. I teach, preach, encourage on a regular basis to my sisters in Christ and how fulfilling it is. I think maybe Lifeway did as David did in 2 Sam. 6:1-11 they did the right thing the wrong way. I will close how I began if my husband is called to be the head of My house why would God ask me to be the head of His...He wouldn't. Beloved let us love on another!

I am not sure how calling anyone names or judging over these kinds of issues serve the Kingdom of God. Can we agree to disagree with others, without becoming like the world. After reading some of the comments, I understand why non-Christians often see us as unforgiving and intolerant. Can we "forgive" those who are mistaken - regardless of their position on this issue?

Even in the NT, Paul sometimes says that he is expressing his opinions (1 Corinthians 7: 25-31, 36-40). Corinthians, Ephesians, etc. were letters written to churches during the time and in many instances deal with specific issues/problems.

When these letters were written, women were essentially chattel (remember the Levitical laws concerning rape? Well, in ancient Greece, women were regarded as profoundly inferior)...From that time until fairly recently, women were always under the jurisdiction or protection of a man--a husband, a father, a brother. This (women's status) was cultural.

But today, things are different. In many places, women are seen as valuable in themselves and are recognized as individuals...much as Jesus recognized us as individuals and children of God with intrinsic value. There are many women who are unmarried, employed and self-reliant--who also live on their own, miles away from their families. This too is cultural....

Look at the teaching on slavery which enabled the degradation of millions of African Americans in this country by "Christian" slaveholders. But slavery in Grecian and Jewish society was not the same thing as slavery in the Americas.

There are teachings on women and head coverings, long hair being a woman's glory, etc.....(1 Cor. 11:13-15. Maybe in some parts of the world, but in others, most women naturally have short hair, so how does this apply to them?

We also have to consider the centuries-long influence on the faith of certain church fathers (Augustine and others) who saw women as useless aside from our ability to procreate.

Is Scripture inspired by God? Of course. Yet the ultimate authority is Jesus. If a woman feel led by the Holy Spirit to pastor a congregation (just as Deborah was called by God to judge both men and women), why should I condemn her?

thank God for these comments. i ve been waiting to ask mine Pastor on Wed. abt this verse but i think i know the answer to it now. Dee thanks for u question abt scriptures being inspired by God n that Jesus is the ultimate authority of it.
From the verious verse given by Kelly, 1Jh3:2, Jh1:2, Rm 8:14-15, Rm 8:17 i believe i'm part of that as a women. I just can't wait to see what God will use me to do in His ministry?
Pls what did Jesus mean when He said the field is wide n dat the labourers are few n dat we shd pray to the Lord of the harvest?
i think, each of us shd pray for God to teach us each of His words us He ment it to be. instead of interpretating it in a way suit us.
abena ghana

Trying to make the individual church situations that Paul was addressing in his letters to the Corinthians and Timothy apply to all churches at all times means having to disregard other parts of Scripture, as well as the historical setting, and culture, etc.

Does Jesus need correcting? Can we believe He was unaware that Paul would write these verses? Obviously He did not think they applied to Mary Magdalene when He chose her as the first witness to the resurrection and the first to preach the Good News to His apostles. These were not small assignments.

Jesus also taught women along with the men - recall that he told Mary and Martha that Mary "has chosen what is better." This was UNHEARD of in their day. No self-respecting rabbi would be caught teaching women. No rabbi of that time would be caught having a conversation with a woman at the well, but Jesus did.

Those who have studied the cultures and languages of the New Testament era reveal that the Christians I Timothy is addressing came out of cults which included sexual acts and fertility rites as part of worshiping a female goddess. In fact, the word "authentein" that is translated as "authority" in I Timothy 2:12 has erotic connotations in the Greek language. He is addressing false teaching.

How many of us would like to take I Timothy 2:15 literally? Should we conclude that all women who die in childbirth are not true Christians? Or maybe we should study deeper to see if perhaps Paul was addressing false teaching about fertility rites.

Why should we conclude that these apply to all women for all time?

@E We are no longer under the Law. Read through the entire Old Testament and you will find no Law prohibiting women's speech. Paul is likely referring to rabbinical law and he goes on to refute their use of it in verse 36 of I Cor. 14.
As you read through the Old Testament you will find Huldah the prophetess:
“Go inquire of the Lord for me…So Hilkiah the priest, Ahikam, Achbor, Shaphan and Asaiah went to Huldah the prophetess, the wife of Shallum the son of Tikuah…She said to them, “Thus says the Lord God of Israel, ‘Tell the man who sent you to me…” II Kings 22:11-20

I would like to say I agree with the comments from Azalea, on Sept. 28, and anonymous, on Oct. 4. In fact, anonymous presented a way of looking at this I had never considered-that if my husband is the head of my house, it stands to reason that God would not have a woman be the head of HIS house. I am thankful that I am not the one to be held accountable for some of the things the "head" of my house will be held accountable for when we stand before the LORD to be judged for the deeds done in this body. I do not understand why this is so hard for people to accept. It makes me wonder what else in the Bible they do not accept and believe. As I understand it, we are either for Him or against Him. And that is an ALL condition whichever side you're on. We are not given an option to pick and choose what we believe from the Bible like a restaurant menu, or a catalog.

I know it's been said that a woman's place is at home & not in a pulpit, but I find it hard to believe that a Loving God would discourage anyone from bringing His Word to a hurting world, whether you are male or female. I've felt a passion in my heart at times to go into woman's ministry, & feel that if anyone feels that that's God's calling; go ahead & pursue the passion! I don't know... I personally feel that you give glory to God in these things, whether male or female.!? I sometimes have a hard time understanding the whole "weaker sex" issue. Please pray for me that God would continue to real it's real meaning to me.

That they did this makes my stomach turn a little.

Dale,

Your comments about being held to a different level of accountability than your husband caused me great concern. The Bible teaches that we are ALL equally accountible before God. There is only one mediator between God and man - that is Christ Jesus according to I Tim. 2:5. If you read Acts 5:1-11, you will find that Sapphira was held equally accountible along with her husband, Ananias, for lying to God. Christ did not die to create a new priesthood of husbands.

Anonymous,

I agree about using texts out of context. However, the view of what "head" means in the scriptures that I see is that the New Testament does not define Christ’s relation to the church as its “head” in terms of authority or rulership. As “head” to the church, Christ is always the Servant who gives the church all she needs to become his radiant Bride. So is a husband to his wife (Eph. 5:25-30), within a relationship of mutual submission. Notice verse 21 “and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ.” applies to ALL believers – not just wives.

Yes, Christ is supremely and universally sovereign, but as “head” for the church, it is not said that He rules over it. Instead, He provides His body with the fullness of Him who fills all in all. He causes the church to grow and flourish. (Eph. 1:22-23)

Christ as head provides the body with oneness, cohesion and growth. This is a servant-provider role, not one of rulership. (Eph. 4:15-16) Christ is head of the church, the body of which he is the Savior. His headship to the church is defined as saviorhood which is biblically defined as a servant, self-sacrificing function, not a lordship role. (Eph. 5:23)

Christ is the head from which the whole body grows because He provides nourishment. He is servant-provider of life and growth to the church. (Col. 2:19) The New Testament defines the headship ministry of Christ to the church as one designed to provide the church with life and growth. This headship is never presented as an authority or lordship position.

While there are hundreds of references in the New Testament to religious, governmental, civic, familial and military authority figures, not one of them is ever designated as “head.” Note that Christ was never called “head” of the church until after his crucifixion, the supreme expression of his Servant ministry as the giver of new life. Whenever Christ is described as “head” to the church, His ministry is that of servant-provider. Similarly, as head to his wife, a husband is a servant-provider of life, of fullness and growth, not one who exercises authority over her.

1 Corinthians 11:3 is often cited as establishing a top-down hierarchy. The components of this biblical text must be reshuffled in order to produce these results. Untouched the biblical sequence is totally different and it does not present a hierarchical structure:
Christ, head of man--- man, head of woman--- God, head of Christ.
The teaching in this text concerns the concept of “head” as giver of life. Christ, as the Word, (John 1:3) gave life to man; man to woman (she was taken from him, Gen. 2:21-23); and in the incarnation, God gave life to Christ (Luke 1:35). This understanding of “head” as “provider of life” is consistent with the immediate context dealing with the significance of origination (1 Cor. 11:7-12).
The meaning of “head” as servant-provider of life in this text is consistent with the headship passage in Ephesians 5:21-33. There, the church is described as being subject to Christ in the reciprocity of servanthood because Christ as "head" is also servant to the church as its Savior and as the source of its welfare.

“Jesus called them to Himself and said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great men exercise authority over them. It is not this way among you, but whoever wishes to become great among you shall be your servant, and whoever wishes to be first among you shall be your slave…” Matt. 20:25-27

I think whatever God decides that man shouldn't put asunder. Also, if God called a man to be a pastor and He doesn't do it I think God will use a woman.

In Christ

I disagree. God is God and how can a man know what God tells a woman?
If the woman is saved and a child of God why would someone say they can't talk about what God wants them to? Let no man put asunder what God appoints. Also, if a man doesn't do what he is suppose to do when God calls him God may very well use a woman. God may decide to use a woman because He wants her there.

In Christ

Wow! The name calling (bone-head, cabbage-headed) of Rev. Seymore at Horizons of Hope in Ft. Worth makes me embarassed for her members. Dear Rev. Seymore, think of how your careless name calling may have diminished the pride your congregation may have at having a woman pastor! I, for one, would visit the elders requesting that they discuss with you the importance of refraining from publishing your own opinions in such an unprofessional, as well as unchristian, fashion. Please, dear sister, grow in grace - for much grace is needed for all practicing christians in this evil day!

I agree with pulling the magazines.
1 Timothy 2:12
12I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. 13For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15But women[a] will be saved[b] through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

Clippy,

Why should we conclude that these apply to all women for all time?

Obviously Jesus did not think they applied to Mary Magdalene when He chose her as the first witness to the resurrection and the first to preach the Good News to His apostles.

Study Christian history and the cultures of the New Testament era. They reveal that the Christians I Timothy is addressing came out of cults which included sexual acts and fertility rites as part of worshiping a female goddess. In fact, the word "authentein" that is translated as "authority" in I Timothy 2:12 has sexual connotations in the Greek language. He is addressing false teaching.

How many of us would like to take I Timothy 2:15 literally?

Should we conclude that all women who die in childbirth are not true Christians? Deeper study reveals that Paul was likely addressing false teaching about fertility rites.

We are saved by faith in Jesus Christ, NOT by birthing children.

Ela